Dr. Sue Morter: Awaken to the Truth of Who You Are

Elizabeth Rovere:

Hello and welcome to Season Two of Wonderstruck. I am your host, Elizabeth Rovere. I’m a clinical psychologist, a yoga teacher and a graduate of Harvard Divinity School. I’m really curious about our experiences of wonder and awe and how they transform us. My guest this time is Dr. Sue Morter. Dr. Sue is the bestselling author of The Energy Codes and acclaimed speaker and the creator of Body Awake Yoga: her seminars, retreats and presentations, as she puts it, illuminate the relationships of quantum thoughts and energy medicine, the elevation of human consciousness and life mastery. But even with all her accolades and innovations, the best way to describe Dr. Sue is to simply say she is a powerful and gracious, loving force. Why, and how she’s become this way, is the topic of our conversation. It starts with an ecstatic awakening. Meditation leads Dr. Sue into an exalted state, where she confronts the beautiful truth of who she really is. From this moment, she understands existence differently, experiences love more deeply, and connects with her body more fully. She soon decides to dedicate her life to investigating this state, and helping others achieve it, make sense of it, and communicate it. It’s something that is not supported in our culture, as Dr. Sue says during the course of our conversation.It is a part of us that has never been nurtured and cultivated. And in the Western world, oftentimes, it has even been discouraged. Dr. Sue’s encouragement is truly moving and motivating. We are divinely supported by a truth that has been known for thousands and thousands of years, she says, and that truth will never remain suppressed.

Elizabeth Rovere:

I do want to start just because you have such a fascinating story. And you went from having migraine headaches, and just sort of feeling, kind of like, flat. Up and down. Fatigue, you had scoliosis. And then you know, you had this really profound awakening experience. And I don’t think we ever get tired of hearing the story. I hope you don’t get tired of saying it or telling it, because it is really quite remarkable. And I was wondering if you could share it with our listeners.

Dr. Sue Morter:
Absolutely. So, I never get tired of sharing it, because it brings something very special into the conversation and into this space, when I begin to speak about a realm that is more real than this one, that I accessed about, almost 24 years ago in a meditative chanting state. My mind was in, you know, what happens when we are repeatedly kind of trancing the mind with a repeated mantra or a chant…is that the thinking mind stills, and what’s available underneath that can rise. And so, I did not know any of that at the time, and I was finding myself pursuing meditation because I had migraine headaches and was trying to find some sort of solution to what I assumed was stress in my life. And I began to immediately have transcendental experiences, the moment that I started truly meditating. And at one moment, I had decided to just go into the ballroom where there were 300 people sitting and you know, doing this meditation process, this chanting. And I sat down and began, I didn’t understand the words, and I didn’t understand what it meant. But I was trying to allow myself to do this. And so, I would have to take deep breaths and I would have to chant long, long sounds that were longer and slower breaths than I was used to breathing. And I was focusing very intently, because I was trying to get the words right. And I was doing it for myself, for reasons that we don’t need to go into at this point, just because of time. But there was a lot of reason that I was sitting down in that moment for me, and I share all of those pieces with you because I know that those are active ingredients in the recipe that is required for us to truly transcend operating from a place that is limited by our five senses, as we’ve been trained to live from them. And so, what happened instantaneously, was I was transported in terms of my consciousness, my awareness into a perception that was completely altered from where we operate on a daily basis. And I was exalted into a place that was brilliant light, just filling every space that I could see, this brilliant light, ten times brighter than the brightest day in the desert that I had ever seen. And there was this beautiful horizon. And I could see 360 degrees, actually, spherically, I could see in every direction simultaneously, which was profound. And yet I had free will, because I could choose to focus over here, or focus up there, or focus down here, over here. And I noticed that I was suspended above the earth, and embedded into it, up to what would have been my knees, and the earth was below me so far, it appeared to be about the size of a marble. And I didn’t have knees because I wasn’t in a physical human body. But I was me, I was this ray of light. And I had always been there. I knew instantly that this was the truth of who I was. And I knew that what was happening was, each time that I took a breath, this beautiful pink, iridescent, translucent blanket of a horizon would rise up as I would inhale. And as I would exhale, it would slowly just rest back upon where it was. And if I took a big breath, it would rise high. And if I took a little breath, it would just rise only slightly. And I knew that what was happening was this light was truly becoming love, as it passed through this system that I was. And I knew that that love was coming to this dimension, to this planet, basically. And I knew that to whatever degree, we each would allow that to happen, it was happening, and the sense of self and fulfillment, and like, wholeness was able to be translated into this earthly presence version of us, if we would only allow that. And the beautiful thing about this was, I knew that I had always been there. I was, it was as if I was seated now as the real me. And I knew that this was true about every one of us. And I knew that this was the truth of who we were, and that we would always be, and that there was nowhere to go, there was nothing to accomplish, there was nothing to become, there was only this truth that we were. And so, in that, there was a complete sense of fulfillment of satiation and gratification, fulfillment, if you will. There was nothing missing, nothing broken, nothing wrong. It was all an illusion that was being generated on the way down into this earthly presence, if we didn’t maintain our true identity, our true orientation as this light. And, you know, I was a doctor minding my business in a clinic, you know, taking care of patients every day, and checking off all the things that we’re supposed to do to be of service in humanity, you know, just doing that. And here I was, in this other world, and I didn’t know exactly what to do with that information, after I came down into, you know, back into my body, as you will, and into the room in this chanting space, I looked around and I was completely stymied. My thinking mind couldn’t even operate, I was only able to observe. I was only able to be present with what was here, and there was no need to do anything other than that. However, you know, life was happening, etc. And so and so it took me a long time to be able to integrate and infuse what had just happened, what I had just become aware of, into my walking, talking life. And I continue to fuse and infuse that information, that presence into my daily life, and into the work that I do, and the teachings that I share with the clients that I work with, and the students that come and, and so forth. Because it’s just a greater truth. It is another version of life that I know humanity would do well to be in touch with. So, I spend my life just, you know, trying to share it in little morsels in whatever way that people are interested, and oriented in a manner that they can truly receive from such an exalted state, really.

Elizabeth Rovere:

An exaltation and a vision and experience. And I’m so appreciative that you’re sharing that with us now. And there’s questions on a very specific level that I think about in regard to hearing you talk about having had that, and then kind of coming back and like, okay. The thinking mind, like, isn’t even going to be able to deal with this. And how do I integrate it so that I can share it? So, there’s that piece. And then there’s also the peace of your experience, right? This is, you know it, like you knew it. It was just, the information came. And the vision of it came. And in my own studies, in religious studies, background and so forth, and literature, there’s like, aspects of that, that had been written about in these ancient tantric texts that you also have talked about in the yoga classes, where, like this universal sense of consciousness, or light, that, you know, when it comes into a form that’s more concrete or matter, or, you know, densified, right, that we sort of forget that we’re connected to that. And that aspects of our life are about awakening to that again, and this truth. And I love that you talk about it from this experience, and then see it in these texts, that it just seems like it’s this greater truth that we’ve forgotten about, as humanity. And so, there’s that, and then there’s the question of like, how did you start to anchor and ground this so that you could share it?

Dr. Sue Morter:

You know, I’ll speak to that piece first. The idea of grounding it is an ongoing orientation, it’s a desire to always be animating it, to always be bringing it to life to reference that experience. And these experiences that I have, in a way that allows that to influence the choices that I make, and the decisions that arise, are truly arising. They’re not coming from my head, they’re rising up from within, where this experience has been, has really activated me on a cellular level. And so, I became curious, like, what would happen, if that was allowed to make decisions in this world? What would happen? How far would love to go from that context? How far would truth from that reality go in this world, where everyone is – you know, not everyone, but so very many – are disconnected from that and searching from the outside in, for the answers in life, and for the decisions that we make, and the projects that we encounter, or the value system that we have established. And what moral code is, and on and on. There is an added element that comes forward, when I’m referencing from that place. When that is my come from, things tend to… it’s as if the seas part. It’s as if challenges aren’t challenges anymore, I see them as something completely different. I see them as an opportunity to express into the density of human confusion. And it allows for me to carve a pathway that is literally, it is filled with grace and ease. And it isn’t mine, but it’s ours to have in a time that we would allow for that to be the priority. And so, for me, it is about living into it every moment. It was such a profound experience. It cannot leave my mind. For many years, it was just on my mind, but it has become my mind. It has become the way that I honor. It has just become a truth that just has to have its place. Now, it’s not always convenient. Because, you know, I’ll be surrounded in circumstances where, you know, oftentimes people aren’t really coming from this place. They’re not, it’s not really about that; they want it, or they might talk about it, but to really step into it and animate it, it’s another thing. And you know, I’m so grateful for the percentage of the population, such as you know, your viewers, that are interested in really preserving and returning to an animated birthing and developing this version of life. This greater truth, this greater love that is available, that on the deepest level we seek; we choose for it, when we can, and we certainly want it to have a bigger place and role in the world. And as we step in this direction, we do make different choices. And we do find solutions in circumstances that others around us are finding problems, and conflict, and pointing out the differences and defending the differences. And arguing the points to see who is right and who is wrong. And from an exalted, you know, from a higher bird’s eye view perspective, there’s something else going on. And I truly think that that’s really what we’re trying to climb up in our awareness, to be able to engage on a higher dimensional frequency for our entire human exchange. And I think that we’re birthing ourselves there now. That’s the challenge that we’re seeing in the world. We’re in the birth canal, and I know that what we’re interested in birthing is to be able to come to life from this perspective of a both and, and that this is all happening for a reason. And the reason is in your favor, and it’s okay. And relax into it and allow it to work for you, these circumstances that you are surrounded by.

Elizabeth Rovere:

Yeah, I mean, it makes me think of the yes and, like being able to look at these both perspectives. I mean, there’s a way in which we’re so polarized, and it’s like, why don’t we, instead of having just that one point of view, let’s try to understand and look at different points of view. And the perspective that you had from being, you know, almost beyond the horizon, it makes me think of that perspective with astronauts when they fly into space, and they look and see the tiny little earth. And it’s like, there’s just this tiny little earth, or the tiny little people on this small planet, and it’s so much greater. And as you say, like this encompassing of like, this pulsating breath and sense of love, that, you know, would be so great to awaken into for everyone. And, you know, I think of you saying, how can I come from this place, letting it guide me? One thing that you’ve said is, the soul speaks to the body, and the body speaks to the mind. Like the mind is in last place at this point, like, let’s just get it out of the way, so we can function a little bit better. And it’s a beautiful thing; we engage in that way in your yoga class. You’re like, close your eyes, you know, see where your body will take you, what position. And then I link it to, when you said, when you were integrating your experience, you would wake up at night in yoga positions. It was almost like it was trying to work through you, and you were allowing it in that process. Is there something you might say about that phenomenon for you?

Dr. Sue Morter:

Absolutely. So, I would wake up in the middle of the night, and I wasn’t a yogi at the time, I was a meditator, but I wasn’t…. and I was just kind of a new meditator. I didn’t really know what was going on. I wasn’t pursuing meditation for enlightenment, I wasn’t, I was just looking for relief from my headaches, and then boom, you know, things opened up. And so, as they were opening, this channel, really, this river of energy, of high frequency energy, which felt like exhilaration and an ecstatic type of sensation in my body all the time. And I was just enlivened and living right there in this technicolor kind of way. And when I would go to sleep at night, I would wake in the middle of the night, and my body would be in these positions that I had never put my body in. I had never been in those positions before. And it was uncanny. Because when I would go to the clinic and try to share it with the other doctors in the clinic, what would happen with me in the middle of the night, I couldn’t even get my body into the same position to demonstrate to them what was happening. My leg would be way up here, you know, just hanging out. Look over and, you know, wow. And it was a phenomenal experience. And I just noticed it and went on. And then several years later, a couple of years later, two or three years later, I believe. Yeah, I went to Bali, and I took a group of students to Bali with me. And part of the package that we had reserved with the tour company was that we would have morning yoga classes. And so, I went to the yoga classes because I was the leader of the whole thing, so I thought I should participate. So, I was five minutes into the yoga class, and all of a sudden, I was hitting these states of consciousness that would take me 45 minutes or so to be in, in meditation, and I was there. And these positions that we were being put in, which I now know are sacred geometries that allow the energy to move through the body in specific ways that incrementally allow for certain qualities of energy to arrive in the heart at a certain time, or in the gut in a certain time, or into the brain in our head at a certain time, up through the primitive brain and into the high brain centers, activating them in certain ways. And I could sense it and feel it and see it. And then I would reference, oh, my gosh, this is a position that is so similar to what I would wake up doing, you know, years ago, a few years ago, in the middle of the night without any, you know, effort or training or even know how. And here I am, in these positions again, and it’s having this effect. And so, I recognized that yoga was birthed by those who had had these awakening experiences. And they were putting their students into these poses, to allow the energies to move through their systems in a way that would enable them, or at least put them in the environment for these openings to occur in their own brains, and then therefore, in their consciousness; or I should say, in the reverse, in their consciousness, and then therefore, in their brains for embodying these higher and higher states of truth, of who we are. So, I was like, you know, a kid in a candy store, just this living laboratory that was now unfolding for me. And I was recognizing that when we would go into these different positions, I was feeling and sensing and perceiving the energy rushing into different areas of the anatomy and including different parts of the brain and nervous system and the electromagnetic energetic channels called meridians, and nadis that have been taught in the east for so long. So fortunately, I had an education in anatomy and physiology from you know, being in school, and could make these translations. And it was just all coming together in such a beautiful way. And it was also so humbling and kind of saddening to think of how far away from that level of truth our humanity has come in terms of never thinking about those, you know, those kinds of things, and not having that as a reference point to orient ourselves through this life. And feeling disconnected, and not knowing that we are a channel of connection that is alive and awake right here, that it is what we’re made of, and what we’re made for. And so much of humanity doesn’t have, you know, that context, and is therefore feeling lost and disconnected and looking to the outer world for the answers and the solutions, because our circuitry has gotten set up, you know, to be externalized. And so what was happening for me, was a re-internalization, which there’s a Sanskrit term called pratyahara that is about withdrawing your senses, come back on to yourself, come in, come deep within, and you will find what it is that you’re looking for out there in such a more graceful manner that is sustainable, and is your true self, and so forth. So, when I say that the soul speaks to the body, and the body speaks to the mind, and the mind doesn’t listen, the mind is just off writing stories all the time and projecting its issues onto others and all of that. When we turn the mind’s attention back onto the self, onto the body, the body then is revealing the language of the soul, and we can learn how to read that and sense it and perceive, and have that true universal intelligence be translated through this system that we are, into ideas and images and projects and answers and solutions and understandings, which translate to love and compassion and, you know, enoughness inside of our life experience.

Elizabeth Rovere:

Yeah, it’s such a fascinating thing in that it’s like, we’re in such a weird little blip of time, right? Where we become so externally focused or materially focused. And you go back through history, as you were saying, in these ancient times, where in the Vedic writings, you see aspects of this, or even in early Christianity, you see aspects of this sort of internal…the focus on love. And, you know, we’ve lost sight of that, even within our history. And as you were talking, I was thinking about William James, the father of American psychology, and he talks about noetic knowing, and once you’ve been revealed this truth of what’s really, really real – he even says really, really, really real – you know, that’s the language in the writing. You can’t not see it, and then what do you do with it? And there’s so many of these aspects of this, as you know, I’ve seen and in your work that you’ve also introduced me to, when you talk about the pineal gland, and the pinecone, and how it seems like there’s so many degrees of separation, but they’re not. Like, the pinecone on the staff of the Egyptian priest, or the pinecone in the Catholic churches in France, and the pinecone as the pineal gland, which is what pineal means, pine. Oh, and then the other piece I recently learned was that even Descartes, you know, the materialist, said that the pineal gland is the physical place where the soul is located, and the third eye. And so, it’s sort of like woven through history, and we’re just in this place where we’ve forgotten it. And so, I guess, you know, I keep thinking about you, you’re coming from this experience. I mean, my sense is that it’s always kind of, it’s always turned on, right? Is it always turned on, that you’re always sort of seeing and experiencing on different levels? That it’s like, just, I mean, how do you handle all of that information coming at you?

Dr. Sue Morter:

Right. So, at first, it was very overwhelming for me, because no one had taught me about embodiment, and integration prior to this happening. I didn’t have a reference at all, which is why my work became about that, about building the circuitry to be able to support such an opening occurring. And it just became my life’s work to do so, because as this was opening for me, there was an immense amount of information, I had to talk so rapidly, just to try to put words to what was coming through my awareness, it was crazy. I would just fly up and down the stage, back and forth, trying to impart this information, just get it out, just get it out. And as the years would go by, and I would build more and more circuitry to sustain it, and to support it, I could actually have a conversation instead of just having to deliver it like a fire hose coming through. And so, it is something that is not supported in our cultures. It is a part of us that has never been nurtured and cultivated. And in the western world, oftentimes, it was even discouraged. And many churches were not interested at all in people having, you know, this kind of talk go on. And there were many, many, many, many different perspectives on the goodness or the badness of investigating such things in one’s life. And I can understand why people have had the ideas about these things that they have had. And I also understand that there could have been some not so ideal reasonings and motivations behind the suppression of that kind of information. And I get it, I understand why the whole thing is playing out the way that it is. But when I was standing in the south of France, just about a year ago, on another sacred journey of taking a group of people on a Mary Magdalene tour, it’s right there in this – in the sculptures, it’s right there in the paintings, it’s woven, and carved into the wallpaper, the columns…all of it. When you know what you’re looking at, you see that the writing is literally on the wall, that we are divinely supported by a truth that has been known for thousands and thousands of years. And that truth will never remain suppressed, it cannot be. While we’re operating as though we’ve forgotten it, just standing there minding my own business, you know, I didn’t expect to go and look and find this kind of thing; I hadn’t investigated how many others had discovered and put those pieces together, short of watching the Da Vinci Code or something along those lines, I, you know, I wasn’t a conspirator or anything, I just was going to see what was there. And there was such a feeling rising up through my system the whole time of, I knew it. And I was so happy for humanity. Because while these things were written about thousands of years ago, and we learn about them as if these were thousands of years ago, things that occurred to these few that were chosen in some fashion, that actually that truth rose in me. I wasn’t asking for it. I wasn’t looking for it, it’s just here. And I opened to that, and it was through the third eye opening that those perceptions came clear. But it was through the embodiment and the building of the circuitry to sustain or to integrate that, that actually allows that to change my life. And so, standing there in the south of France, I’m witnessing that there are symbols from ancient Egypt, right in the same paintings with Mary Magdalene. And there are symbols from what are referred to as new age, you know, science kind of stuff that is the flower of life, and sacred geometries, and they’re painted all around the statues. That’s what the wallpaper – it’s not wallpaper, it’s painted. But that’s what it is. It’s all the same structures that for thousands of years have been a greater truth that represent different dimensional perceptive fields of consciousness. And I know that, because I visit those perceptive fields, and I see it regularly. And now I’m standing there with a tour of people and looking, you know, coming around the corner and seeing this and just pointing it out. And so thrilled for humanity, because basically, it is this….that if we are in our hearts, and we are truly in our bodies, and we learn how to do that, what happens as a byproduct is that truth rises, whether we know how to translate it, because we’ve studied this, that or the other or not, the truth itself rises. Think of it like truing, there’s a truing that rises. It’s not the truth, as in scriptures that you can memorize or things that are true, it’s not a noun, it’s a verb, this truthing is rising. And what that means is, we all have the capacity to stand in any situation, and feel our truth, on a deep, deep, deep level, this real, real, real truth that you’re speaking about, and allow that to come up and give it a voice and allow that to be what makes our decisions. And that to be what gives us our ideas and our inspirations and then, there leads to our invitations to others to engage in certain ways. It’s available to all of us. So, I stood there with tears running down my face, just knowing that no matter what, whether it’s just been forgotten, or whether it was suppressed, none of it really matters. The fact is, it will always rise, there’s nothing that we can do. No effort, or no amount of ignorance for any amount of time, will ever keep the truth from being available. As soon as we start learning how to receive, perceive, and be with that. So, I get very passionate about it.

Elizabeth Rovere:

And why not? Because it’s so powerful. It’s so hopeful and inspiring, and positive and fascinating. You know, and like you’re saying, like you were in France, and you start seeing it, and it’s there, and it’s there. And it’s there. It’s like, it’s coming in all through all the corners and everything else. And then you share that with us. And you know, now I go to let’s say, I’m at the tile or the wallpaper store, and then I see the flower of life. And it’s like an opening. And it’s like, oh my god, this is so cool. That it really is, in that way, everywhere. It’s exciting. I mean, I was just, I happen to start reading about the pineal gland. And then I was like, Oh my God! There’s a whole thing about the pineal gland with ancient Mesopotamia and ancient Persia; not the pineal gland, per se, the pinecone, like the sacred pinecone. I was like, Wow. I mean, I’ll never look at the pinecone in the same way, and how wonderful, how grateful I am for that. But that’s what’s so, so cool. Because I think my experience when I’m learning about this, or experiencing very little bits and aspects of it, is that I feel a great sense of relief. I feel like, it’s okay. There’s a process to what’s happening. It’s not so chaotic or discordant, even if it is in this moment, on that level, on this level, feeling that way. Like, kind of coming back to that process of remembering that there is something that’s greater, and I guess, leading into another question about that would be this question about transformation. The transformation isn’t something that happens out there. It happens out there, but it comes in here. Like it’s within the body, it’s inside. And then it’s, how do you then live from that place, is what is transformative. And I feel like that’s what you do. And you bring it to other people, to bring it to everyone in a way that’s very grounding, and genuine, and humble. And I don’t mean to, like, compliment you too much, but it’s very real. It’s very authentic. And I don’t think you always see that.

Dr. Sue Morter:

You know, people say this often and I feel it. You know, as a child, I was very intimidated. I was very shy. And it was because what was inside of me wasn’t matching what I was observing other people say and do, or they would say something, but their actions didn’t match with what the lesson was supposed to be, or the teaching, or the point, or the principle was. And it was just so confusing to me, that I withdrew. And I was just shy, I just was like, no, I don’t know how, I don’t know what to do. And so, when this began in my life, you know, it was totally transformative. And it wasn’t that I like, you know, burst out, from a personality standpoint. It truly just started, something else started speaking, it was not my shy self speaking; it was I’m shy, but there’s this thing coming up out of me. And that thing that was coming up and out of me, is trying to come up and out of all of us. And, you know, when we speak about in here, versus out there, you know, and this is helpful for me to think of it this way. And this is what science is showing us is actually happening in the world of quantum reality. And that is that all physical matter is compressed energy, it’s energy that is just packed together. So, the chair that we’re sitting in is compressed energy, the screen that we’re looking at is compressed energy, the keyboard, the table, the what have you, and the physical body that we are in is compressed energy. And so, it’s energy that is compressed. And now if we decompress it, we can decompress it all the way out to the unified field again. We can trace it all the way, and it’s the same elements that the cosmos is, the constitution of the cosmos. And so, we are literally the universe compressed into physical form. So, there isn’t really something different in here, than what’s out there. It’s the same, it’s just that we haven’t built the circuitry to perceive internally. Because when we land, we sort of splat and in that splat, we disperse our energies, and we look to the outer world to figure out, who am I? What’s going on? You know, am I okay? Am I fitting in? Am I doing what the big people want me to do, etc. And so, we are oriented with only part of who we actually are. But equally important and significant, in fact, more so really, is what’s on the inside. It’s the same energy, but we haven’t been tending to it. We haven’t been building circuitry to perceive it, we haven’t been listening, we haven’t been connected, we’ve rendered it basically pointless while we were busy making it work on the outside. And so, then we start studying, like, how do you receive? And how do you get that, that in here. And the truth of it is, what’s out there is already in here, because in here is made of what’s out there, incrementally. It’s a continuum. It’s a continuum that has compressed itself, here to physical form. And so, we’re engaging here as points of consciousness, but we’re really all, if we decompressed, boom, we would all be that oneness again. And it’s helpful for me to think of it this way. So, when I’m speaking about these multiple dimensional fields of, or realms of consciousness, there is a version of us that is this physical self, in the third dimension. We are these physical beings that are flesh and bone, etc. In a fourth dimensional version of who we are, we are geometrical shapes, but not yet in animation in the way that we know it here, in physical flesh and bone. In a fifth dimension, we are conscious, but we are more representative of just color, and presence of a different essence and such. So sometimes when people, and it goes on, but oftentimes people are connecting with the third, fourth and fifth dimensional, these just various realms of who we are. And so, when they meditate, they might close their eyes and they just see purple. And the reason they’re seeing purple, or they just see red, or everything turns orange. What’s happening is, we’re waking at a higher vibrational place on the spectrum. So, think of it like this spectrum where it’s pure, formless light, the highest vibrational frequency is light, and then we compress and compress and compress and compress and compress and compress, all the way down to physical form. So, if we back that up a little bit, we come to an area where we’re pure light, and then light into color, and then light into shape, and then light into animation of humanity as we know ourselves as flesh and bone. So, when people are kind of waking up, back up the spectrum, they might close their eyes and just see color. And the reason they’re perceiving the color is because they’re resonating, they’re seated at that place on the spectrum. So, they’re kind of waking at a higher vibrational frequency version of who they are. Sometimes people might see, they might do some breathwork and then close their eyes, and they might see like a checkerboard behind their eyes, or they might see a lacy latticework type of thing, which is very common in ancient India and the teachings of India, they have different geometrical patterns associated with the different chakra levels in the body, that have different geometrical shapes associated with different levels of consciousness that are represented as the chakras. And people learning about the chakras kind of understand that there are different, you know, dispositions that go along with these different energy centers. But it isn’t just about being an energy center, it’s about these levels of consciousness. And so, when someone sees those shapes, it’s because they’re waking at that dimensional version of themselves. And that pineal is starting to, it’s like a dimmer switch, it’s starting to open and perceive in the dark. So, for me, it lit up, boom. But for many, it kind of is like a dark light, like, like gray on black, or like sepia tone, and brown on brown kind of energies, but they can kind of see images and shapes that just occur to them. And if they look at the image in the meditation, the image goes away, because we start plugging into a different set of circuits that are trained to see out here, it’s a different set. The observing mind is what can perceive these images and such in the inner realm. So, these realms that I speak about, I’m working through these realms, always, every time I meditate, I’m in one place, I find my consciousness activated or active in one realm, or another one version, or one vibrational radio station or another, if you will. So, in the midst of that, I have had lots of wild experiences that, you know, we probably don’t have time for that today. But you know, of literally relating to other places, like other locations, like on other planetary type of existences, and stuff like that. And it just sounds kind of crazy to talk about it out of context. But, you know, maybe some time we can go into a deeper conversation about that, but it, you know, we exist all the way up and down the spectrum. We exist from pure light, all the way here to physical form. And there’s a lot in between. It’s been referenced as the angelic realm, when all the paintings of the angels and the winged ones and the glowing halos over heads, it’s because the pineal is open and these things are being depicted. And these other realms are representative of what I’m describing. And so many, many versions of this in ancient Egypt, that’s what the hieroglyphs are all about, and the stories that they tell are about higher states of consciousness. So, the higher the state of consciousness, the more we can perceive these other realms. And if we’re grounded and integrated in the body, we can translate them in a way that makes sense and becomes relevant to our life here as a human being on earth. And if we’re not, it just kind of becomes crazy talk, you know, and it spins out, and allows people to just seem too swirly for us to be able to count on what they’re saying. And, you know, and I just wish for everyone to be able to ground and integrate, because that person that someone might think is a little, you know, out there, could actually bring a lot of brilliance here, if they would just learn how to come into their bodies and center and ground, their translation of the information I feel would bring brilliance into our humanity. And those that are brilliant here, and we consider the geniuses of our time, are in their body with that same kind of opening. And so, we get that they get it, and I think that they’re actually, you know, coming from the same place, it’s just how down to earth have they been able to bring their center point of consciousness. Their landing pad, if you will.

Elizabeth Rovere:

Right. Yeah, no, I appreciate you saying that. Because there’s two things, like one is like, if you look at like, even the religious art, and you see people with the halos and you see these pictures, it’s like, hey, it’s I mean, it’s not so out there because it’s right there. Right? But if we talk about us, it happening to us in this moment, it sounds completely a bit loopy, right? And yet, there’s also the thing I can’t believe I forgot to even say, or we didn’t connect was that the pineal gland has rods and cones. It has the cells that are in the eyeball, in the pineal gland. Like, why is that there? If it’s not seeing or having the capacity or something?

Dr. Sue Morter:

There are light receptor cells, there are cells that are designed to perceive light. But they’re perceiving a higher frequency light than the visible light form that we’re trained to see with our outer eyes. This inner eye is perceiving the higher frequency light of these higher dimensional, you know, realms or radio stations, if you will. They’re not radio stations but just as an analogy for people. To perceive this, this higher truth, it’s literally like the light bulb inside that is perceiving and allowing us to connect the dots. So, our job is to create enough circuitry and stability underneath it, that we can translate that information in a stable manner. Without it, you know, just seeming off the wall.

Elizabeth Rovere:

But when you talk about circuitry, I feel like I think that some of our listeners wouldn’t understand what you mean by circuitry, or they might think of neurocircuitry, which may be a little bit of it. But could you explain that a little bit?

Dr. Sue Morter:

Sure. So first, we are energy that compresses itself into physical matter. So, the nervous system would be way down here at the physical matter level: because we can touch it, we could dissect it, we can pull the nerves you know, and, and work with them in a physical manner. But something built those nerves, and what guided the building of the nervous system was an electromagnetic energy, that out here at the energetic level, is formless. And it begins to compress and compress, and it starts to take shape and form along the way. We become, we go from light to being kind of misty, liquid light, and then we become this aqueous solution, that then becomes this gelatinous type of structure that you were just referencing, and then it becomes thickened and quickened into photons, and atoms and molecules and structure that becomes cells and organs and glands and systems, like the nervous system, or the hormonal system, and so forth. And so, on that continuum, each of those layers or levels of us, is vibrating at a different frequency. And so, the circuitry that we are working with in the work that I teach, is to carve a pathway with consciousness, through the electromagnetic energy flow, through the electromagnetic energy system, which starts to bring consciousness through the pathways that built the nervous system. They are still there, the meridians are there, which are electromagnetic, energetic pathways, like streams, or rivers that are running through the body. And the nervous system is sort of imitating those on a physical level. And so, acupuncture utilizes these meridians and nadis and routes through the use of insertion of needles, etc., to reroute the energy and get it moving and flowing again. And it has a healing effect. So, what we’re doing with consciousness is teaching people how to carve those pathways for themselves, that would allow them to remain connected to their deep true self, or even find it in the first place. And allow that to become so acclimated, and so repeated and rehearsed, that the energy flowing in those certain pathways starts to create a density of consciousness, or photon density, little packets of energy that follow thought. That’s how we create anything. Everyone knows that when you put your energy, your thoughts or your mind to something, that it will eventually kind of become true. The more you pay attention to something, the more it actualizes in your life. You pay attention to love, and love happens in your life. You pay attention to anger and anger gets bigger, you know, it’s that kind of a thing. And so, what we’re doing is developing photon density in these neuro electromagnetic pathways of energy flow. And that density creates something that your sensory nervous system can then feel. It’s like, oh, there’s somebody in there. I feel solid in there instead of feeling empty. I can feel my gut feelings, I can perceive them instead of them blowing right past my mind that’s busy off here writing a story. It creates enough robustness inside of our gut feelings, and our inner wisdom, and our heart of hearts, our inner knowing, that truth that’s trying to rise now starts to build substance, and be able to move, and when it’s moving, we can perceive it. And so, when once our sensory system can perceive it, it starts collecting that information, that information comes to the brain, translation happens, motor responses come back. And now we have an engagement, we have a track that is now creating neurosynapses that allow for us to, through the vagus nerve input and the integrative nervous system, we now can make form thoughts and ideas based upon these energetic impulses that are moving through our system. So, we can translate that into decisions and words and new ideas, etc. So that’s always been happening, it’s just that we didn’t know that’s what was happening until quantum science was giving us more of the missing puzzle pieces that are referencing the fact that we think something, and these tiny little packets of energy, the smallest things that we can measure, they move in accordance with our thoughts. So we know that we can create a vacuum, and we can think a thought into that vacuum that has a few randomly placed photons in there, and the photons will move just because we’re looking at it, just because we’re thinking about it, or we’re thinking something into that, like Emoto, who did the research on the frozen ice and showing all the different crystalline structures, it’s the same thing. That when you think a positive thought, the crystals, the liquid crystal or the ice crystals would form in a certain shape. And when you think a different kind of thought, a negative thought or positive thought, they rearrange accordingly. Well, that’s happening inside of our bodies all the time. So, what we’re doing is using this to carve pathways in the energy field, consistently, so that we create enough photon rearrangement that we can start to feel ourselves in our bodies for the first time maybe in our lives. And we can start to trust ourselves, because there’s somebody in there instead of it feeling empty, and answer-less, and you know, just full of questions and confusion.

Elizabeth Rovere:

On a more concretized analogy, I think of you know, in psychology, we talked about making the unconscious conscious, but there’s a way in which you’re talking about making the body the system, the entire energetic realm; I mean, making what is you in a greater sense, become more conscious to you, that you really…as you say, waking up in this way, and functioning–

Dr. Sue Morter:

–we are definitely becoming more conscious to what was unconscious, it’s been unconsciously driving us. And now we’re landing our awareness on it and listening and feeling our way into it. And because the whole system at large wants awakening to occur, that’s why we come, that’s why we’re here. And we’re here to wake up to the truth of who we are. And so, the system is trying to facilitate that process, but we just haven’t been using our minds to help, we’ve been off onto something else, and it hasn’t been paying attention to the project at hand.

Elizabeth Rovere:

And when you when you have that process, where you’re waking up more to this aspect of who we are, the truth of who we are, I mean, I think about some of the experiences that you’ve had, or that you’ve shared with the community about…you’ve taken groups to Egypt, and you walked into a temple or a pyramid and you’re like, I remember being here. You know, I’ve had the experience with being here. And then I link it to, I think you had told a story where you were just out shopping one day, and you saw a sailboat, and all of a sudden you had this sense that you knew how to sail. So you went, you bought a boat, and you went sailing. And laughing to myself, I’m like linking, you know, remembering memories of Egypt to sailing, but it’s the same idea, right? The same kind of experience. And I’d like to just put it out there, because it happens. And I think it’s, people would like to be like, oh, that’s normal, if that happens to you. And it’s also wonderful. It’s like an incredible, like, opening experience.

Dr. Sue Morter:

And if only people can give themselves permission to trust that, what happens is we get to actually start experiencing the true self, where we’re having original thoughts, and we’re creating a life based upon this deeper knowing, and giving that deeper knowing the life that it came here to have, instead of suppressing it and judging it and thinking, Oh, I’m just crazy, I’m just, you know, I don’t know what that was, and just brushing it off. And then going on about our days and living, you know, robotically or only half awake. What happens when we connect the dots and allow this to be a guiding light, and we’re grounded and integrated. We make strong, clear, consistent decisions. The reason that people have a hard time trusting it, is because people live in their heads. You know, we’ve been trained to live in our heads, we overthink, we’re trying to analyze, we asked six friends, what should I do, and we’re not feeling anything. We’re just gathering information and strategizing. And the problem with that is we’re disconnected. We’re disconnected from a system that is built to give us the information that the universe is made of. That’s how powerful and potent we are. We’re made of that. But we’re not in touch with it because we’re living in our heads. And so when we, every once in a while, get an impulse that rises all the way up to our head, just inadvertently, just accidentally or coincidentally, and we take action on it…if it’s not grounded, if we’re not integrated, we’re not using the body to really be able to translate that information, so that we’re perceiving it accurately; so that we draw conclusions that are actually going to work for us, instead of just seeming like, off the cuff, and shooting from the hip all the time, and out of left field. And who is this crazy person that’s saying this or doing that? Or what’s going on? And we question ourselves, like, what am I doing, nobody else is doing this. But when you’re in your body, and you’re grounded, and you’re feeling to do something, that isn’t what everybody else is doing, per se, necessarily. You’re not questioning it, because you know. You can’t not know what you know. And when you take action on that, your life unfolds in a graceful manner. Meanwhile, everyone around you is, you know, beating themselves silly trying to make it work and get things together and make it happen. And you’re just like, I don’t know why this isn’t so hard, but it’s not. And here I am, I’m arriving at the place that you’re either also arriving, but are exhausted, or I’m arriving at a place that you’re trying to arrive at. And it’s like, so filled with grace and ease. You wonder, you know, the mind wonders, how does this happen? But this deep knowing is like, you know exactly how this happened. It’s because, we would call it having faith in yourself and trusting yourself. But the mind can say trust yourself. But when the soulful self says trust, you’re telling the mind to trust that…it’s a whole different, it’s a whole different invitation. And a different life unfolds as a byproduct of that.

Elizabeth Rovere:

Going back very specifically to the sailboat, you just went out and sailed. And you could sail. Just like that.

Dr. Sue Morter:

It was like I’ve done it a thousand times for thousands of years. Like totally, totally knew what I was doing.

Elizabeth Rovere:

Did you remember like, experiences from thousands of years ago? Or was it just like a physical like, I just know what I’m doing?

Dr. Sue Morter:

I had had, even before all these openings in the year 2000. I had had, I don’t know if they were before that, or during or after, but they seemed to be unrelated, even though they were part of the same, you know, history. But I don’t hold them in my mind as, I remembered this because of my openings. But yes, I have memories of being on the sea, wasn’t the ocean, it was on a sea. I was on a sea. And there was a lot of storm, and wind and water just you know, pouring on me. And I was just holding on. And I wasn’t afraid, I knew that it was treacherous. But I had the physical, cellular memory of weathering the storm. So it was really funny, when I got the sailboat and the guy that sold it, you know, sold it to me showed up to launch the boat that day. We were, you know, he’d sailed it out to the middle of the lake and said, well, are you ready, and I was like, I’m sure I am. And I, you know, took hold of it. And the wind just hit my face, just at this angle. And I turned the boat, right, you know, not right into the wind, but just to this angle to the wind, and it just took off. And he’s like, you’ve been sandbagging me, there’s no way you don’t know how to sail. And I was like, I swear, it’s the first time I’ve ever had my hand on the tiller of a sailboat.

Elizabeth Rovere:

…In this lifetime.

Dr. Sue Morter:

And I had the reputation of being the one who was going out from the marina, when everybody else was coming in, when there’d be a storm. I was attracted to the storms. And I suppose it’s because of, you know, some kind of memory that is just loving that it’s back at it again, in some way.

Elizabeth Rovere:

It’s great. It’s great. You know, one of the questions that I have, that I generally ask people, and I feel like you’ve…every answer, you’ve answered this question, is what is an awestruck or wonderstruck moment for you, that stands out? And there’s just like, the thing I think is like, oh, that must be happening all the time. I mean, but is I mean, of course, the sailboat, but is there something maybe that just comes to mind immediately when I asked you about a wonderstruck moment that you would share?

Dr. Sue Morter:

You know, I have them all the time. And I feel that anyone can. I am in awe of the beauty of how the universe is operating, how humanity is being gifted with so much grace and opportunity to awaken. And here’s, this might be a flip for people. If there’s something persisting in your life, that it just feels nagging and it keeps showing up or you keep repeating, you keep doing things again, and we have a tendency to dupe ourselves in those moments and say, I don’t know what’s wrong with me that I keep, you know, doing this. Or what, you know, what’s the bad luck or what’s the penance that’s being paid here? When in reality, I see it from this perspective that, you are so loved, you are so loved. And there’s so much grace guiding your life, that this situation that is nagging you, is actually just never going away until you get how magnificent you are, until you surrender into your bigness. Because usually when we’re in resistance to something, we’re arguing for our smallness, we’re actually usually trying to stay the same, and don’t change me, and don’t tell me what to do. And we’re pushing things away. When in actuality, I know this, from my perspective of what I can see, that the universe is always trying to unpack us. That’s the only thing that’s happening, is trying to create space between the particles so that this truth can rise. And so, the situations in our lives that we find frustrating, are actually evidence that we are so loved, that this parent, or this, you know, this loving adult is never going to have this thing go away, until we have a chance to get ourselves together, to orient ourselves to actually get it. To embrace. It’s like, I’m gonna keep teaching you, I’m going to keep setting you up for success until you surrender into your greatness instead of continuing to fight and squander and pretend that you’re not enough, or that you don’t have what it takes, or that you’re never gonna get it or you don’t deserve this, or it’s not going to happen for you. Because that’s all the illusion that we’re here, you know, trying to rise up and out of. And we are divinely guided and supported to do that. And if people would just turn their attention to perceiving it from this flipped – I call it the quantum flip – perceiving it from this other perspective, they would be in awe all the time at how much grace is here. How much love is actually here for them. And I feel that, you know, I just wake up in the morning and I see the light dancing on the water, and the lake behind my home. And I’m just, I’m stilled by it. It literally overtakes me, the beauty of life, in nature and in people’s ability to have an a-ha moment, or to forgive something, or to reveal vulnerably in a moment where they previously would have protected themselves, and taking themselves out of the game. I’m awestruck by the grace that is right here, always, all the time, for us. So, it’s not that I don’t have my moments. Because I do. But I’m also awestruck by the beauty of remembering, and finding the circuitry for that moment, to also be filled with this consciousness that we are, truly are made of.

Elizabeth Rovere:

Yeah, that’s so beautifully said. And I really appreciate you saying it. And as you were speaking, I was having all these different associations, and one of them was when we were in France, and we were looking at the gargoyles on the cathedrals, and about like, facing the demons, right? And then having them sort of melt away within this concept, this, I guess experience, or the greater love, right? But also, just the idea of facing the demons, and the demons might be not realizing one’s magnificence. Like, that’s the demon. I also thought about this, because I tend to think about this a lot when I’m doing yoga particularly, but I think of your yoga, BodyAwake Yoga as you know, exalted warrior and humble warrior, this access or this connection to the divine, and then the humility of it, and the exaltation of it. Like this beautiful combination, as an aspect of awe. I think it’s even on your, sometimes you see the little characters in those poses, within your advertising and stuff. Sometimes you see these little characters, I’m like, it’s perfect. It’s perfect.

Dr. Sue Morter:

Right. And that is it. There are parts of each of us that are already awake, we are exalted in this way. And there are parts of us that are diving deeply into our own unconscious and wanting to, and are here to do this, and are completely supported to have this be done. That we’re delving into the aspects of us that we’ve not yet shone the light of our own consciousness upon. And when we humble in and buckle over and are buckled over by life or taken in this way. All that’s happening is you’re not being abused, you’re not being – it’s not so abrasive that, you know, you can’t take it – it’s actually on a bigger picture scale. It’s drawing you into the deep, guttural level of your being, where you humble into humbly bringing the light into the part of you that was afraid to come up and out. Or that was not ever tapped, or that was left behind, when we got busy trying to please the big people, and fit in, and do the right thing and all of that. So, the humbling of life is only so that we will go back in. And, you know, no one left behind sort of idea, the spirit of it is: you’re having it all, we’re not going to let you get by with not having it all. And so, when we feel humbled by life or taken, you know, taken in, it is truly the quantum flip of that is, there is no part of you that doesn’t deserve to be in this exalted light. But it can’t be until we go in and free it up. And we certainly haven’t been taught how to do that, until we are. And that’s, you know, that’s what you’re doing here by bringing these conversations to everyone. It’s what I’m doing in my way, in teaching the yoga that I do and teaching the coursework that I do. And all of that, it’s us collectively knowing that we’re here for this, we can do this. And when we intend to go in after it, it doesn’t feel like I’m just going in after my wounded self. And you know, I have to heal this up. And it’s bad. And those people were bad that did that thing to me that hurt me in the first place. And I gotta forgive them. It takes on a different flavor; it takes on this gracious expedition of bringing the light into the density, and contributing to the awakening of humanity. The expansion of human consciousness into a more full and robustly demonstrative version of the truth of who we are. And so yeah, the humble warrior, and the exalted warrior life is really about those two poses, right? It’s about what we know and what we forgot. And what we’re remembering and what we’re going in after. And yeah, just, if we can just make it be, you know, a project, and not take it so personally devastating, then we’re waking to the truth of why we’re here, and what we’re capable of.

Elizabeth Rovere:

Yeah, it’s more real and even more enjoyable. And I think that with the words that were coming to mind, as you were speaking, I was thinking about, like joy and grace, because it’s not just like all, skipping about through the roses like everything is perfect. It’s not, it’s the bigger picture. And it’s dealing with all of that, those, whatever demons or the difficult times, and the, you know, complaining about this and that. And like, looking at the big picture and incorporating it and seeing it and waking up to all of it, it becomes real. And alive in a very powerful way. That if you’re just stuck in the negative, if you’re just stuck in the positive, you don’t get the whole thing.

Dr. Sue Morter:

Yeah, yeah, that bypass it’s referenced as a bypass by many, that people think that it’s all about the exalted and that is all, it only has to be that. But for us to truly evolve or to awaken, but really in order for the tree to grow, we have to deepen the roots. So, it’s both and, right? We can’t only go in after our stuff all the time, and we can only ever be up in the, you know, the beauty of life. But if we see that the whole thing is beautiful, that’s what I’m trying to share; is that the whole process is beautiful, and exalted, and the work of the spiritual warrior, or however you want to look at it. It is the animation of grace that is happening. And when we do, what we develop is an appreciation for every human experience, not just going for the positive human experience, but being positive about all human experiences, so that when you are hurting, there is a grace around the hurt. And you know that there’s a reason for the hurt, not the person who hurt you. But there’s a reason that you’re hurting. And if you were awake in that area, it wouldn’t hurt so much because you would see that even if it was a bully projecting onto you something, because they were feeling whatever, it’s theirs. And if we are fully awake and integrated, we can hold the space when they project upon us, to hand it, you know, hold it here and say, this isn’t mine. And I’m here to help you take a look at why you feel the need to throw it at me. Because it’s only fear that would have you be doing that, etc. Now, not everyone’s going to be open to that conversation. And it doesn’t have to be a conversation, literal. But if we have the understanding of it in our system, we can hold it that way. And therefore, it actually allows a precious moment for us to experience ourselves as truly integrated in this way that is of service to humanity. To our own life, and to the lives of others, really being no longer fear based. And really being based in the inquiry, of the adventure of awakening, because that’s why we’re here.

Elizabeth Rovere:

The adventure of awakening and being open to that process. It’s exactly it, that’s great. I can’t tell you how much I appreciate you being on our Wonderstruck podcast. It’s such a gift.

Dr. Sue Morter:

It is a great joy, always, to be in this conversation and a special joy to be here with you. So, thank you for the invitation. And I’m happy to accept another, anytime.

Elizabeth Rovere:

That was Dr. Sue Morter. Thank you so much, Dr. Sue. To learn more about Dr. Sue’s work, check out DrSueMorter.com. Please come back next time on Wonderstruck, when I’ll be joined by William Robert, Syracuse University Professor of Religion, and an award-winning author of Unbridled, Studying Religion in Performance. For more information about Wonderstruck, our guests, and our events, check out wonderstruck.org and please follow the show on Apple Podcasts and Spotify, and subscribe on YouTube. We truly want to hear from you with your feedback, reviews and ratings. You can also follow us on Instagram, X, Tiktok and Facebook at wonderstruckpod. Wonderstruck is produced by Wonderstruck productions along with the teams at Baillie Newman and FreeTime Media. Special thanks to Brian O’Kelley, Eliana Eleftheriou, Travis Reece, Josh Wilcox and Nikki Dindo. Thank you for listening. And remember, be open to the wonder in your own life.